Over the last week, I fancied playing about with computers and a different operating system so I decided to blow the dust off an old laptop and have a play with Linux operating systems.  I already had a few CD's I'm made of a few Linux operating systems from when I tried them out some time ago but they were now a bit out of date.  So I downloaded a few new ones to try out.

First, I tried openSUSE because this is one which was highly recommended and praised for use on Laptops, especially Netbooks.  Unfortunately, it didn't really install very well on my old laptop and after several attempts which took an age each time, I gave up.

Next I tried the most popular one for Desktops, Ubuntu. I've used Ubuntu before and was impressed with it then.  I was still impressed with it in operation, once it was up and running but I wasn't impressed with how long it took to actually install and get started.  Windows 7 installs way quicker and easier than Ubuntu.

Then I tried Linspire, a copy of which I had on CD from a few years ago.  Linspire started life as Lindows until Microsoft took them to court to get them to change the name.  In the end, they settled out of court, Microsoft bought the rights to the Lindows name only and Lindows changed the name to Linspire.  Linspire is brilliant, very quick to install, very fast to load and very link Windows in use.  Sadly, it's now out of date with no support for it.  Linspire was later bought out by Xandros who still carry on with a version of Linspire but have called it Xandros instead.  Sadly, Lindows, Linspire and Xandros are not free but pay-for systems, something which angered a lot of die-hard Linux lovers.  Because of this, Xandros did bring out a free version called FreeSpire which I decided to try next.  Well, I tried it and hated it immediately.  It was next to useless!  LOL

I then downloaded a neat program called unetbootin which allows you to download and install a few Linux distros directly to a flash drive. (Distros is short for distributions, the name given to the various different versions of the Linux operating systems developed over the years) You can then boot a laptop directly from the flash drive so I decided to try them on my Netbook, booting Linux from the flash drive without installing Linux to the hard drive.  I tried Puppy Linux which was great for it's amazingly small size but pretty useless unless you had a dial-up modem, or wanted to spend time finding drivers for Wifi because Puppy Linux was designed for dial up modems anyway.  I tried Linux Mint, Fedora and about 5 other different versions of Linux.  Each had their own different and quirky features but none of them made me feel overly impressed with them, especially the time it takes to install them compared to Windows 7.

It was fun to play anyway and if I was to use a version of Linux, it would have to be Ubuntu 9.10 Live, booted from the USB Flash Drive rather than installed over my precious Windows 7!  Yes, I could have set up a dual-boot system where I had the choice of Windows 7 or Ubuntu but I didn't want to do that.  Before Windows 7, I would have agreed that Ubuntu installs and boots faster but it's still very limited to me since I have and use a lot of MS programs, programs which I am used to now.  The good thing about Linux is that it's free (with the exception of Xandros) but then, you get what you pay for, I guess.

That interesting read!

The only versions of Linux I tried was Debain cos uni use those for Networking and Ubuntu on my laptop vitural machine because I needed for my uni coursework. I am going to get rid of it as soon I finish uni cos I don't like Linux much.

It's good to see someone trying out different operating system. I was the same in the old days and while Linux has improved over the time, they are still behind their competitions. I didn't have time to faff about with all different settings to ensure that all of my new hardware to work - therefore Windows wins.

I'm still on Vista on this main PC, moving to Windows 7 soon as I have got lot of stuff to backup first. All of our laptops are on Windows 7 already and liking it.

We need to get Mr Fin to come here and give his views on this.

Sorry I am going to have to disagree on legmanic on this one.

My understanding that most windows come pre installed on hard drive so they will have drivers already for that spec of computer so it wont have other drivers hanging about or other conflicting software.
It will be a different story if you installed a fresh windows 7 from disc to computer.
How ever you installed Ubuntu and have everything running on start up so to speak.

Sorry old chap, you're wrong. Sort of.
That might have been the case with XP and pre XP.
However, with Vista and especially Windows 7 (oh yes, Windows 7) all drivers are automatically downloaded instantly. Trust me, it's fantastic! XP (and previous windows) used to take 40 to 60 minutes to install from a fresh reformat but Windows 7 takes just 14 minutes! I'm not joking!

And Ubuntu is NOT infallible. I've installed Ubuntu on two laptops now, an oldish one and a new one and in both cases, it failed to recognise, download and install suitable drivers for Wifi Network (old laptop) and modem (new laptop) whereas Windows 7 did both of them no problem.

Your understanding of Windows coming pre-installed only applies to shop bought machines built for that purpose and supposedly made simple for the PC illiterate. Which, for the most part, works for the PC illiterates. However, I delete/uninstall most of the $hite that comes with new machines. Even installing a fresh copy of Windows, I simply visit the PC manufacturers website for the latest drivers for said machine and download and install all the drivers for that machine and operating system. It's not rocket science.

Well, not for me anyway and probably not for you. And speaking of PC illiterates, most wouldn't understand how to use Ubuntu so Windows 7 wins hands down in this case. I would certainly not recommend Ubuntu to the non-technical and faint-hearted and I'm sure you wouldn't either.

What also makes me laugh is how some people go on about Windows being "bloatware" - that is, an operating system being bloated (stuffed) with other programs and features built in. Well, I found Ubuntu no different. It's the same with Macs too.

Speaking of Macs, there's a lot of unrest with Apple at the moment, especially with the news that Apple are no longer supporting Flash and favouring the supposedly better HTML5 (being supported in IE9) and even Adobe are fighting the case, not surprisingly.

And finally, I have to say - I've tried Ubuntu.  Have YOU tried Windows 7?

Indeed... Windows 7's driver support is a LOT better compared with XP and Vista. It's great!

Yep. I remember doing XP to Vista took FOREVER to install and setup, install all software back again. Windows 7 was hell lot better. I can only do it few hours, also I don't need to install all softwares, some are already there, moved from Vista to Windows 7.

Ubuntu all drivers downloded , which in my case wifi and most are on disc anyway had never had problems on any pc, but obvously anything too new or too old you bound to have problems.
You wouldn't put windows vista disc on an old pc that ran windows 98 would you? Same applies to Ubuntu but ubutu does work on old pc if you know what your doing try doing that with windows?
I wouldnt be suprised if you could with windows 7 but I have not looked into it.

For most part in regarding [Beep] software pre installed on peoples windows pc I do remove them but some people fear it will break their pc or invalid their warranty and to be honest most part it does make windows run slow.
I can only advise people but at the end of the day you get what you pay for.

My understanding you have bought windows 7 disc and its not come pre installed then congratulations, as you know that when hard drive dies your windows licence goes with it.
You have wisen up to Microsoft ways of extracting more money from you.

Thing is when you buy a pc it comes windows pre installed everything is set up for them , and to be honest give them windows disc or ubuntu one they wouldnt have a clue.
My bet ubuntu get installed easily with windows so many settings and inputing windows licensce . But as you say windows 7 is better so they have taken a leaf out of linux ;-P

If you wouldnt give ubuntu non techinical or faint hearted do you say the same with a mac ? do you advise them not to get a mac too?

My mum uses Ubuntu , and several people I know round here have Ubuntu installed because they had no end of problems with windows last install was to a 78 year old man ( it was linux mint did not have ubuntu to hand) they are the PC illiterates they just want to surf the internet and not have to worry about updating antivirus, running antispyware and the likes.

When you think about it why do they need a OS just to surf the internet as its what most people do these days and there is a talk about having non OS laptops which linux is perfect for that (Linux is just a kernal) boot and use a web browser and you dont need Microsoft for that :-)

Interesting !

What were they teaching you , uni had good reasons to use Debian better networking support.

Yes, I have done. In fact, I have Windows 7 installed on a machine which was designed for Win 98 and Windows 7 on my Netbook which came with XP installed.
The difference is, you can find drivers for machines with Windows by going to the PC manufacturers websites whereas it's much harder to find drivers for Linux.


Have had that happen and no problems, it will register itself again on the new hard drive, providing there hasn't been any other major changes to the hardware in the same machine. But even if there has and it doesn't register, a quick telephone call to an automated service at Microsoft will generate a new authenticity key. I've actually done this three times now and it's worked every time. Sadly, people like yourself think the worst of Microsoft when it comes to things like this.


A Mac would come already set up and running. A totally different thing to giving someone a copy of Linux and letting them get on with it.


I do agree with that. The people I deal with when it comes to PC's use their machines for far more than web browsing though. At the end of the day, it does depend on their requirements, their use and what software they aleady have and whether they wish to continue using it, using what they know and are familiar with.


That's because you're brainwashing them!


And if they're thick enough to cock up their computer with Windows, they're thick enough to cock it up with Linux too. It's not Windows that is the problem, but the spyware and other stupid programs they install and stuff they accidentally delete. I teach my friends and family about good PC use, not fob them off with Linux.

From my experience they cock it up with windows and don't cock it up with Linux.
I have installed all os and never been a problem except windows is a bit of a faf to do
So far I have never installed windows 7 but have been fixing 3 so far, managed to get rid of virus without a re install .

People ask what I use and I tell them and if they have a spare PC its installed for them if they ask. only one asked to have it removed as a windows expert tells them its rubbish.
I told them use that expert to fix their computer in future.

At the end of the day if your used to windows then stick with it included with its faults.
I dont have time with [Beep] like that although I charge people to fix their windows pc at a time that suits me.

You can accidental delete any files in windows but you cant in linux (except in home folder) as you would have to have password or be in root :-)

Some manufactures do release drivers for linux but not all of them do as we are only volunteers it takes time for us to catch up and write the drivers.

As I said in another post - a computer illiterate.
The workings of a Hub is nothing to do with the OS.

Never had a problem with Windows and never had a problem removing a virus.
Never had a problem with Windows installs, especially 7.

In fact, since recommending 7 to friends, I get less requests to sort them out.

I have nothing against Linux, it's a good OS but not if you're used to Windows or have Windows programs you're already used to.

As for experience, I've had the experience that a friend of mine cocked up his PC after installing linux and wanted to go back to Windows, but the "grub" wouldn't let him. I was called upon to sort him out and get his PC back to his beloved and trusted Windows.

Nuff said?

I believe Microsoft has now since updated the licence agreement... as long as it's the same PC shell with the following:

* Motherboard
* Memory
* HDD

then you can re-activate it without any problems.

However if you're moving it to another PC with different shell and hardware specs, then it "dies" - that's how OEM licensing works.

For the grub you only have to write a few command to boot into windows but bet you noticed that linux haven't wiped windows off.


The workings of a hub some have Linux installed :-)
Everybody uses linux without realising it

You spoke about PC illiterates so what is a PC expert?

I have fixed 3 windows 7 so far in a small town of mine same old story I am affraid..
Yes boot time is quicker but not against ubuntu not the ones I am using.
Yes its better that privouse windows but I fail to see anything new over ubuntu I am affraid.

What prompted you to shell out a another windows OS?

So if your mother board dies you have to get a new mother board with the same specs make and model?
What if you saw another and its cheaper?

As I mentioned above, it's not a problem.

I've changed a motherboard on 2 or 3 machines with an OEM copy of Windows.  A message popped up that I had to re-authenticate due to a change in hardware. A quick telephone call to Microsoft on the number provided in the pop up, an automated service where you punch in the numbers you see on screen in the pop up on the telephone keypad, the automated service then generated a new authenticity I had to input on the PC and Windows was once again activated.

No, you misunderstand. The friend wiped Windows off his hard drive by doing a reformat, installing only Linux. He later decided he didn't like Linux so wanted to wipe it and install Windows again and go back to what he had before but somehow he cocked it up and couldn't get rid of it. LOL I had to sort it out for him.


And your point is?


What indeed. I don't claim to be an expert but I get by.


That does surprise me.


Because it's better? Because it's faster? And because I needed it.

pc's for basic [beep] are that cheap now, you just give em away or buy a new one if it goes [beep] up.
I just reinstall to earlier date as im not clued up as you both know..
Why the fuss, you can send/recieve emails and do the bizz...so whatever you choose to use its the bizz...

(pre moderated prior... due to obscene language usage ...)

For what £80 ?? I think i will pass on that one.

I struggle to find what you can do on windows 7 that you couldn't do on xp or vista.
My workplace they have no need to upgrade.....

It's not a question of finding Windows 7 doing things that XP or Vista cannot, Mr Fin, it's more a question of a better, faster and cleaner operating system and one which is SO much quicker and cleaner to install.  However, there are indeed things in Windows 7 that are not in XP or Vista but I guess it depends what you do on your machine as to whether they would be used or useful to you or not.


Each to their own I guess, everyone is different but having used Windows 7 for quite a while now, I wouldn't go back to XP and I certainly wouldn't bother with Vista.

Ok.

So if you all had a choice it be windows 7?

I will stick to Linux and by the time I get another laptop which will have what ever windows pre installed i will have a play on it. at the moment windows vista which i down graded to xp.

For most people only use a pc just for surfing the net as one woman put it a pc is useless without an internet .
really for most you dont need an OS if its just basic surfing .

I use my laptops for most stuff, but probably don't use them to their potential, I know my techy minded son does things like spreadsheets and a multitude of stuff.

Internet, Photos, word processing and above all reports for work and keeping up with family and you guys who entertain, inspire and support me in areas I'd thought I was alone with.

Its marvelous....